CO129-295 - Public Offices - 1899 — Page 683

CO129 Colonial Office Hong Kong Records 理藩院香港檔案 All AI Reviewed

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requirements of the West River navigation and trade, we would readily assent to your suggestion that they should have a trial to test their merits, but there can be no hope of eventual satisfaction with a system which seriously impairs the value of the original Concession.

We have carefully read the letter from Sir Robert Hart which you have been good enough to forward, and while admitting that his views are important on the working of Rules and Regulations which he himself has drawn up, we take exception to the interpretation given them. The difficulty with which the Inspector-General was confronted was, we readily admit, a very serious one, for he had the choice of coming into conflict with the interests of the provincial authorities in the matter of revenue on the one hand, and on the other, the necessity of so construing the Rules and Regulations as to render their working in no respect inimical to the provincial system of revenue. He adopted the latter course, with the result that the value of the Inland Navigation Concession has been affected to an extent which manifestly could not have been contemplated by the British Minister at the time of its negotiation. The Memorandum which we previously forwarded to you afforded full information of the effects of the Rules and Regulations as now worked, and we do not deem it necessary to supplement them; but we would beg to point out that the trade between Hong Kong and the West River, and between the Treaty ports themselves, is not of sufficient volume to allow of steamers being run profitably, but with liberty to call at way ports, ..., inland places, permission for which has been withdrawn since we addressed Sir Claude MacDonald on the 28th March, the increased traffic would in time probably be remunerative. The pioneer steamers which are now running cannot cover their expenses under existing conditions, and others specially constructed for the trade which are now leaving the builders' hands, and others again which had just been contracted for, had better not have been ordered.

In view of the foregoing, we venture to again seek your good offices in the hope that you will be able to bring about a more practical and reasonable construction of the Rules and Regulations as they affect navigation on the West River which, as already mentioned, cannot be said to have been opened to trade in the sense contemplated by Sir C. MacDonald and understood by the public at large.

We have, &c. (Signed)

JARDINE, MATHESON, AND CO, General Managers, Indo-China Steam Navigation Company (Limited).

BUTTERFIELD AND SWIRE, Agents,

China Navigation Company (Limited). THOS. ARNOLD, Secretary, Hong Kong, Canton, and Macao Steam-ship Company (Limited).

3

these Regulations ought not, however, it appears to me, to be strained to attain this object.

The Imperial Chinese Customs have decided that it is necessary to separate the two branches of traffic, interport and inland.

This separation seems reasonable when the consequences, which would result from the adoption of another method, are considered, as pointed out by Sir Robert Hart.

The question of the opening of the West River and the opening of the inland waters are separate ones, and the two branches of traffic are governed by separate Regulations.

It would be regrettable if experience showed that one branch of traffic cannot be made to pay without the aid and assistance of the other, and a request for a modification of the Rules and Regulations might eventually be based upon that ground, but sufficient time has not, in my opinion, elapsed, nor have sufficient data been, as yet, forthcoming, to enable me to take action to obtain such a modification at the present time.

I am, &c.

(Signed)

FL. O. BAX-IRONSIDE.

Gentlemen,

Inclosure 3 in No. 1.

Mr. Bax-Ironside to Hong Kong Shipping Companies.

Peking, August 24, 1899. YOUR letter under date, Hong Kong, the 17th June, forwarded under flying seal through Her Majesty's Consul at Canton, and addressed to me, only reached this Legation on the evening of Saturday, the 19th instant.

Referring to my letter to you of the 17th May, I beg to state that I referred the whole question of the Rules and Regulations for Inland Steam Navigation in China to the Foreign Office for the consideration of the Marquess of Salisbury, Her Majesty's Principal Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs.

I am personally of opinion that the ruling of the Imperial Chinese Customs as laid down in Sir Robert Hart's letter to me of the 12th May, copy of which was inclosed in my letter to you of the 17th May, is a fair one, in view of the aim of the original Concession, which was to allow foreign merchants to use steam-vessels for conveyance of goods in the interior, in places where they have hitherto been allowed to use native boats.

It appears to me that you are anxious to obtain a share of the native carrying trade of the interior, which trade was not formerly carried on by foreigners using native boats. If this can be done under the existing Regulations well and good;

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679 2 requirements of the West River navigation and trade, we would readily assent to your suggestion that they should have a trial to test their merits, but there can be no hope of eventual satisfaction with a system which seriously impairs the value of the original Concession. We have carefully read the letter from Sir Robert Hart which you have been good enough to forward, and while admitting that his views are important on the working of Rules and Regulations which he himself has drawn up, we take exception to the interpretation given them. The difficulty with which the Inspector-General was confronted was, we readily admit, a very serious one, for he had the choice of coming into conflict with the interests of the provincial authorities in the matter of revenue on the one hand, and on the other, the necessity of so construing the Rules and Regulations as to render their working in no respect inimical to the provincial system of revenue. He adopted the latter course, with the result that the value of the Inland Navigation Concession has been affected to an extent which manifestly could not have been contemplated by the British Minister at the time of its negotiation. The Memorandum which we previously forwarded to you afforded full information of the effects of the Rules and Regulations as now worked, and we do not deem it necessary to supplement them; but we would beg to point out that the trade between Hong Kong and the West River, and between the Treaty ports themselves, is not of sufficient volume to allow of steamers being run profitably, but with liberty to call at way ports, ..., inland places, permission for which has been withdrawn since we addressed Sir Claude MacDonald on the 28th March, the increased traffic would in time probably be remunerative. The pioneer steamers which are now running cannot cover their expenses under existing conditions, and others specially constructed for the trade which are now leaving the builders' hands, and others again which had just been contracted for, had better not have been ordered. In view of the foregoing, we venture to again seek your good offices in the hope that you will be able to bring about a more practical and reasonable construction of the Rules and Regulations as they affect navigation on the West River which, as already mentioned, cannot be said to have been opened to trade in the sense contemplated by Sir C. MacDonald and understood by the public at large. We have, &c. (Signed) JARDINE, MATHESON, AND CO, General Managers, Indo-China Steam Navigation Company (Limited). BUTTERFIELD AND SWIRE, Agents, China Navigation Company (Limited). THOS. ARNOLD, Secretary, Hong Kong, Canton, and Macao Steam-ship Company (Limited). 3 these Regulations ought not, however, it appears to me, to be strained to attain this object. The Imperial Chinese Customs have decided that it is necessary to separate the two branches of traffic, interport and inland. This separation seems reasonable when the consequences, which would result from the adoption of another method, are considered, as pointed out by Sir Robert Hart. The question of the opening of the West River and the opening of the inland waters are separate ones, and the two branches of traffic are governed by separate Regulations. It would be regrettable if experience showed that one branch of traffic cannot be made to pay without the aid and assistance of the other, and a request for a modification of the Rules and Regulations might eventually be based upon that ground, but sufficient time has not, in my opinion, elapsed, nor have sufficient data been, as yet, forthcoming, to enable me to take action to obtain such a modification at the present time. I am, &c. (Signed) FL. O. BAX-IRONSIDE. Gentlemen, Inclosure 3 in No. 1. Mr. Bax-Ironside to Hong Kong Shipping Companies. Peking, August 24, 1899. YOUR letter under date, Hong Kong, the 17th June, forwarded under flying seal through Her Majesty's Consul at Canton, and addressed to me, only reached this Legation on the evening of Saturday, the 19th instant. Referring to my letter to you of the 17th May, I beg to state that I referred the whole question of the Rules and Regulations for Inland Steam Navigation in China to the Foreign Office for the consideration of the Marquess of Salisbury, Her Majesty's Principal Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs. I am personally of opinion that the ruling of the Imperial Chinese Customs as laid down in Sir Robert Hart's letter to me of the 12th May, copy of which was inclosed in my letter to you of the 17th May, is a fair one, in view of the aim of the original Concession, which was to allow foreign merchants to use steam-vessels for conveyance of goods in the interior, in places where they have hitherto been allowed to use native boats. It appears to me that you are anxious to obtain a share of the native carrying trade of the interior, which trade was not formerly carried on by foreigners using native boats. If this can be done under the existing Regulations well and good;
Baseline (Original)
679 2 requirements of the West Kiver navigation and trade, we would readily assent to your suggestion that they should have a trial to test their merits, but there can be bo hope of eventual satisfaction with a system which seriously impairs the value of the original Concession. We have carefully read the letter from Sir Robert Hart which you have been good enough to forward, and while admitting that his views are important on the working of Rules and Regulations which he himself has drawn up, we take exception to the interpretation given them. The difficulty with which the Inspector-General was confronted was, we readily admit, a very serious one, for he had the choice of coming into couflict with the interests of the provincial authorities in the matter of revenue on the one hand, and on the other, the necessity of so construing the Rules and Regulations as to render their working in no respect inimical to the provincial system of revenue. He adopted the latter course, with the result that the value of the Inland Navigation Concession has been affected to an extent which manifestly could not have been contemplated by the British Minister at the time of its negotiation. The Memorandum which we previously forwarded to you afforded full information of the effects of the Rules and Regulations as now worked, and we no not deem it necessary to supplement them; but we would beg to point out that the trade between Hong Kong and the West River, and between the Treaty ports themselves, is not of sufficient volume to allow of steamers being run profitably, but with liberty to call at way ports, .., inland places, permission for which has been withdrawn since we addressed Sir Claude MacDonald on the 28th March, the increase traffic would in time probably be remunerative. The pioneer steamers which are now running cannot cover their expenses under existing conditions, and others specially constructed for the trade which are now leaving the builders' hands, and others again which had just been contracted for, had better not have been ordered. In view of the foregoing, we venture to again seek your good offices in the hope that you will be able to bring about a more practical and reasonable construction of the Rules and Regulations as they affect navigation on the West River which, as already mentioned, cannot be said to have been opened to trade in the sense contem- plated by Sir C. MacDonald and understood by the public at large. We have, &c. (Signed) JARDINE, MATHESON, AND CO, General Managers, Indo-China Steam Navigation Company (Limited). BUTTERFIELD AND SWIRE, Agents, China Navigation Company (Limited). THOS. ARNOLD, Secretary, Hong Kong, Canton, and Macao Steam-ship Company (Limited). 3 these Regulations ought not, however, it appears to me, to be strained to attain this object. The Imperial Chinese Customs have decided that it is necessary to separate the two branches of traffic, interport and inland. This separation seems reasonable when the consequences, which would result from the adoption of another method, are considered, as pointed out by Sir Robert Hart. The question of the opening of the West River and the opening of the inland waters are separate ones, and the two branches of traffic are governed by separate Regulations. It would be regrettable if experience showed that one branch of traffic cannot be made to pay without the aid and assistance of the other, and a request for a modifi- cation of the Rules and Regulations might eventually be based upon that ground, but sufficient time has not, in my opinion, elapsed, nor have sufficient data been, as yet, forthcoming, to enable me to take action to obtain such a modification at the present time. I am, &c. (Signed) FL. O. BAX-IRONSIDE. Gentlemen, Inclosure 3 in No. 1. Mr. Bac-Ironside to Hong Kong Shipping Companies. Peking, August 24, 1899. YOUR letter under date, Hong Kong, the 17th June, forwarded under flying seal through Her Majesty's Consul at Canton, and addressed to me, only reached this Legation on the evening of Saturday, the 19th instant. Referring to my letter to you of the 17th May, I beg to state that I referred the whole question of the Rules and Regulations for Inland Steam Navigation in China to the Foreign Office for the consideration of the Marquess of Salisbury, Her Majesty's Principal Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs. I am personally of opinion that the ruling of the Imperial Chinese Customs as laid down in Sir Robert Hart's letter to me of the 12th May, copy of which was inclosed in my letter to you of the 17th May, is a fair one, in view of the aim of the original Concession, which was to allow foreign merchants to use steam-vessels for conveyance of goods in the interior, in places where they have hitherto been allowed to use native boats. It appears to me that you are anxious to obtain a share of the native carrying trade of the interior, which trade was not formerly carried on by foreigners using native boats. If this can be done under the existing Regulations well and good;
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679

2

requirements of the West Kiver navigation and trade, we would readily assent to your suggestion that they should have a trial to test their merits, but there can be bo hope of eventual satisfaction with a system which seriously impairs the value of the original Concession.

We have carefully read the letter from Sir Robert Hart which you have been good enough to forward, and while admitting that his views are important on the working of Rules and Regulations which he himself has drawn up, we take exception to the interpretation given them. The difficulty with which the Inspector-General was confronted was, we readily admit, a very serious one, for he had the choice of coming into couflict with the interests of the provincial authorities in the matter of revenue on the one hand, and on the other, the necessity of so construing the Rules and Regulations as to render their working in no respect inimical to the provincial system of revenue. He adopted the latter course, with the result that the value of the Inland Navigation Concession has been affected to an extent which manifestly could not have been contemplated by the British Minister at the time of its negotiation. The Memorandum which we previously forwarded to you afforded full information of the effects of the Rules and Regulations as now worked, and we no not deem it necessary to supplement them; but we would beg to point out that the trade between Hong Kong and the West River, and between the Treaty ports themselves, is not of sufficient volume to allow of steamers being run profitably, but with liberty to call at way ports, .., inland places, permission for which has been withdrawn since we addressed Sir Claude MacDonald on the 28th March, the increase traffic would in time probably be remunerative. The pioneer steamers which are now running cannot cover their expenses under existing conditions, and others specially constructed for the trade which are now leaving the builders' hands, and others again which had just been contracted for, had better not have been ordered.

In view of the foregoing, we venture to again seek your good offices in the hope that you will be able to bring about a more practical and reasonable construction of the Rules and Regulations as they affect navigation on the West River which, as already mentioned, cannot be said to have been opened to trade in the sense contem- plated by Sir C. MacDonald and understood by the public at large.

We have, &c. (Signed)

JARDINE, MATHESON, AND CO, General Managers, Indo-China Steam Navigation Company (Limited).

BUTTERFIELD AND SWIRE, Agents,

China Navigation Company (Limited). THOS. ARNOLD, Secretary, Hong Kong, Canton, and Macao Steam-ship Company (Limited).

3

these Regulations ought not, however, it appears to me, to be strained to attain this object.

The Imperial Chinese Customs have decided that it is necessary to separate the two branches of traffic, interport and inland.

This separation seems reasonable when the consequences, which would result from the adoption of another method, are considered, as pointed out by Sir Robert Hart.

The question of the opening of the West River and the opening of the inland waters are separate ones, and the two branches of traffic are governed by separate Regulations.

It would be regrettable if experience showed that one branch of traffic cannot be made to pay without the aid and assistance of the other, and a request for a modifi- cation of the Rules and Regulations might eventually be based upon that ground, but sufficient time has not, in my opinion, elapsed, nor have sufficient data been, as yet, forthcoming, to enable me to take action to obtain such a modification at the present time.

I am, &c.

(Signed)

FL. O. BAX-IRONSIDE.

Gentlemen,

Inclosure 3 in No. 1.

Mr. Bac-Ironside to Hong Kong Shipping Companies.

Peking, August 24, 1899. YOUR letter under date, Hong Kong, the 17th June, forwarded under flying seal through Her Majesty's Consul at Canton, and addressed to me, only reached this Legation on the evening of Saturday, the 19th instant.

Referring to my letter to you of the 17th May, I beg to state that I referred the whole question of the Rules and Regulations for Inland Steam Navigation in China to the Foreign Office for the consideration of the Marquess of Salisbury, Her Majesty's Principal Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs.

I am personally of opinion that the ruling of the Imperial Chinese Customs as laid down in Sir Robert Hart's letter to me of the 12th May, copy of which was inclosed in my letter to you of the 17th May, is a fair one, in view of the aim of the original Concession, which was to allow foreign merchants to use steam-vessels for conveyance of goods in the interior, in places where they have hitherto been allowed to use native boats.

It appears to me that you are anxious to obtain a share of the native carrying trade of the interior, which trade was not formerly carried on by foreigners using native boats. If this can be done under the existing Regulations well and good;

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